This will be an arguement/issue that will go on forever. end

well said irave i have always said you dont learn how to drive till you have crashed

All this has nothing to do with driving, but with alcohol. raising the drinking age to 21 seems like a likely option for them now

Quote: Originally Posted by GMHBT1 my suggestion to this is to not let people under 21 drive any sort of v8 or turbocharged car or even a high performance non turbo version such as sv6 and also n/a xr6 etc. doesn't an n/a xr6 have the exact same motor as a regular ba xt? regardless, it doesn't matter what car you're driving most can get up to stupid speeds, some just get there a little quicker. ****, my stock N13 pulsar hatch got to 170, highly doubt that'll ever see a ban list for being anywhere near a performance car. Quote: Originally Posted by tab let alone a powerful car like a xr6. dude they're not powerful at all. my xr6 felt about as quick as my v6 statesman.

Quote: Originally Posted by MQH All this has nothing to do with driving, but with alcohol. raising the drinking age to 21 seems like a likely option for them now I really doubt they'd consider that esp since it'd be for 1 state only plus as someone said earlier this appears to have resulted from a backyard party, trying to enforce such legislation there would be impossible

Make the consequences of drink driving incredibly tough. First time, huge fines like we spoke about earlier. Second time, you're going to jail. Not for all offences, just drink driving. The facts are, if he wasnt drunk, he probably wouldnt have lost control, even at that speed!

I agree with Kane on that well said.

Kane, i'm wondering if the guy had a history of speeding offences? if so then yes the alcohol contributed but don't blame it solely on alcohol, otherwise you could say "if he drove slowly while drunk then the crash wouldn't happened", he sped (big time, plus an overloaded car) as well as being drunk saying that i do support increased penalties for DUI/PCA

Quote: Originally Posted by aus880 I really doubt they'd consider that esp since it'd be for 1 state only plus as someone said earlier this appears to have resulted from a backyard party, trying to enforce such legislation there would be impossible Imagine how much money the government would loose in lost sales tax if they raised the drinking age from 18 to 21, that alone is enough to stop such a law being drafted.

Quote: Originally Posted by ATMO_BT1 Imagine how much money the government would loose in lost sales tax if they raised the drinking age from 18 to 21, that alone is enough to stop such a law being drafted. considering the actual cost to the community of damage caused by drinking: vandalism/assaults/other crimes etc i think the govt would actually be ahead if they upped the age for drinking however it won't happen in just 1 state and i doubt even more it'll happen right across Australia anyway is drink driving the main cause or even a major cause of loss of life amongst young drivers?

No, but it is a major cause of Injuries/Fatalities on our roads every year! Therefore, make the punishment harsher. Then we may see less people willing to do it.

yeah i agree but do you think it would have stopped this prang ?? you could have life imprisonment as the penalty and some would still take the risk, that's the problem pls don't use the ! Kane, i imagine you shouting everytime you post anyway

Quote: Originally Posted by ANK mitch 7 and a half drinks really isnt that much man yes it is way over the legal limit but its not like super pissed how do you know it was 7 1/2? also how many standard drinks. mixed or premixed? over what time period? had he rested before the party or was he already tired from work... theres more too it than how many drinks he had. i can honestly say i havbe never drank drive as a p plater and as a fully licensced driver i have started drinking mids / lights and i count. and i am bloody carefull about it all. havben't had more than 3.5 standard and driven yet. and that adds up to about 3 midstrength beers over 2-3 hours.

Quote: Originally Posted by aus880 advanced driver courses will make many think they are even more invincible than they think they already are The problem is an inability by young drivers to make smart and informed decisions. Apparently that part of the human brain develops sometime in the early 20's I therefore suggest raising the licence age to early 20's, by that stage more people have the ability to make informed decisions about their driving 100% agree And to the bloke that said take them to the Hospital to see the aftermath/rehab, better yet take them to the morg so they can see how horriffic these crashes are and how fragile a humans body is, its like wet bread falling apart when you hit a tree at 140kmph

Quote: Originally Posted by CRMNL doesn't an n/a xr6 have the exact same motor as a regular ba xt? regardless, it doesn't matter what car you're driving most can get up to stupid speeds, some just get there a little quicker. ****, my stock N13 pulsar hatch got to 170, highly doubt that'll ever see a ban list for being anywhere near a performance car. yes maybe your pulsar can get up to 170 and thats all well and good but it wouldnt with a 110k speed limiter. my guess in this instance is had that xr6 been fitted with a 110k limiter there is a good chance less of them would have lost there lives and the force of the impact would have been far less. in my opinion it doesnt matter what car your in. if your on p plates your car must be equipped with a 110k speed limiter be it na xr6 sv6 n13 pulsar hyundai getz toyota landcruiser it doesnt matter what it is. and if for some reason your caught duping the system then take there licences away for periods of time.

Quote: Originally Posted by GMHBT1 my guess in this instance is had that xr6 been fitted with a 110k limiter there is a good chance less of them would have lost there lives and the force of the impact would have been far less. Hitting a tree at 110 instead of 140 isn't going to make much of a difference. People die all of the time with crashes at less than 110km/h and I can guarantee that the majority of crashes occur at less than 110kmh. It's rare that its a high speed (140+) crash, most are 60-100kmh. Anyway, there's more uses for a road registered car than just driving on the road. What if you want to race it on weekends? You'd cut wicked 60 footers then sit it on the limiter for the remainder.

Quote: Originally Posted by PROGMH Hitting a tree at 110 instead of 140 isn't going to make much of a difference. People die all of the time with crashes at less than 110km/h and I can guarantee that the majority of crashes occur at less than 110kmh. It's rare that its a high speed (140+) crash, most are 60-100kmh. yes i agree most are 60-100kmh accidents but how many of them is there where 5 people are killed in any of them. seriously injured yes odd few killed but nothing like this. Quote: Originally Posted by PROGMH Anyway, there's more uses for a road registered car than just driving on the road. What if you want to race it on weekends? You'd cut wicked 60 footers then sit it on the limiter for the remainder. again agreed. BUT we are talking about new and inexperianced p plate drivers here so there is no need for them to be cutting wicked 60 footers let alone drive any sort of hi performance cars on the streets. when there a little older with more road experiance and off there p plates then there is no limit to what they can drive. in the meantime sure if they have another project car that is super hi performance car which they want to race on weekends and does wicked 60 footers then by all means throw it on a trailer take it to the proper facilitys to do so and let them run rampant because in all reality they cant be doing wicked 60 footers on the street nor going beyond 110kmh on any public highways in victoria. also forgot to add watch today tonight topic is hoons and videos.

You seem to like the 'wicked 60 footers' comment. I'm just saying I don't think it's the answer. If the crash were at 100km/h then the issue of speed limiting wouldn't even come up. I heard today that a guy had a car crash out the front of the driver's funeral. He was late 40's, blew 6 times over the limit when he crashed his car. I havn't heard one news article saying that he was a 'hoon' or that his car should be crushed... and I bet I don't hear it either.

people say inexperienced P platers this and that trying to be hero's etc, despite there often being alot of "hero's" out there alot of red P platers enjoy cars and are responsible. im on my red P's, had them for 8 months now. im not saying im the best driver, because i know i still have alot to learn and i can see that every day wen i drive, BUT.... im often sitting on 60kms in a 60 zone and seeing 40 year old ppl over take me doing 70 or more, they say P platers hooning and speeding all that, but realistically u can make a statistic say watever u want it to say. when i was on my L's and doing 55 in a 60, i was considered a ball breaker for those who are driving with full licence, the next day i get my P's and im considered a hoon. its the mentality that needs to change and then hopefully the behaviour can follow suit.

Quote: Originally Posted by PROGMH You seem to like the 'wicked 60 footers' comment. I'm just saying I don't think it's the answer. If the crash were at 100km/h then the issue of speed limiting wouldn't even come up. I heard today that a guy had a car crash out the front of the driver's funeral. He was late 40's, blew 6 times over the limit when he crashed his car. I havn't heard one news article saying that he was a 'hoon' or that his car should be crushed... and I bet I don't hear it either. ur 100% spot on, but then again some young drivers stuff it up for everyone. and then we all get labelled as a hoon.yesterday people where doing skids as they left the crash site, there`s marks everwhere. what sort of immpession does that leave?? let alone any respect for the people that died.