hey all, Just a bit of a newbie Q, i did a search but i couldn't find a clear answer. do you still require the std ECU or any other form of ECU when you go straight GR? Cheers in advance Rick-

Quote: Originally Posted by RIX-PSI [View Post] hey all, Just a bit of a newbie Q, i did a search but i couldn't find a clear answer. do you still require the std ECU or any other form of ECU when you go straight GR? Cheers in advance Rick- yes you still need to control spark

Thanks, so you can basically remove a large portion of the loom to?

Quote: Originally Posted by RIX-PSI [View Post] Thanks, so you can basically remove a large portion of the loom to? if its for a vl you can piss everything off thats fuel related, canisters, injector looms etc if its related to spark or can alter the spark curve keep it, e.g. air flow meter, oxy sensor, knock sensor, idle bypass, temp controlls etc if you go aftermarket you can gut 90% of the old loom slow and steady and mark it all out

Cheers heaps for that! much appreciated!

does the dizzy need to be controled by the ecu. couldnt you piss of the whole loom and ecu if you wanted to? the gas setup is carby right?

We normally use a Haltech IG5, but you can use other tyres of ECU's. just send the car to someone who KNOWS how to do it LPG isnt easy and a lot of people waste money trying when Jason ghiller has already proved his setups... Some original photos have not been recovered yet.

i was just thinking for a daily driver, couldnt it be set up like an old school carby setup. just dizzy plugs and gas carby nothing else. im not familr with the gas research setup. but if its a carby why you need or want CAS, oxy sensors, MAF and so on?

Quote: Originally Posted by l67calais [View Post] i was just thinking for a daily driver, couldnt it be set up like an old school carby setup. just dizzy plugs and gas carby nothing else. im not familr with the gas research setup. but if its a carby why you need or want CAS, oxy sensors, MAF and so on? Rb30's in Patrols had either carby or EFI, The carby ones had no ECU and just ran an electronic dizy. you can run one of these with lpg and as you were thinking. For simple street setup with around 200rwkw i would recomend from experence the use of a 200 Impco mixer with 2x B2 converters 600x300x75 cooler and retain the standard ecu to run the stock dizy. If the engine is a N/A one I'd use a 3mm Cometic head gasket and have the head machiened for a good seal. Set the timing up as factory and the car will start nice and drive good off boost, will also have no probs makin 200 at the wheels. Use 8mm pnumatic push in fittings and 8mm plastic hose ran from the balance ports in both mixer and converters,. for tune up set idle to 1 lambada and full load/boost the same. Do not run any ritcher than about .85 lambada as it will miss fire and will make the combustion too hot. if you run it any leaner than 1 lambada it will be cooler in combustion but will loose power. No need to gap plugs down at this mixture setting. This is a very cheap way to make good power and tuning can be done on the Road with a Air Fule Rratio Guage in about 10 mins.

yeah i have a na calais and was thinking of going straight gas and turboing it. what is the advantage of keeping the ecu to control spark. wouldnt i then have to keep afm and cas and 02 sensor for ecu to work properly, which wouldnt be used by the gas side of things? im yet to speak to a gas shop about this though. will i regret getting rid of the ecu.

Quote: Originally Posted by l67calais [View Post] yeah i have a na calais and was thinking of going straight gas and turboing it. what is the advantage of keeping the ecu to control spark. wouldnt i then have to keep afm and cas and 02 sensor for ecu to work properly, which wouldnt be used by the gas side of things? im yet to speak to a gas shop about this though. will i regret getting rid of the ecu. The way i said only needs stock dizy and ecu. no afm and no 02sener, The ECU is simple as! was made in the 80's. Just let it do the spark and be happy, that's all its good for.

ok, thanks for the feedback. impco systems work fine with blow thru turbo setup? most people have said go gas research, but it is a bit more pricey than others. do i really need a thicker head gasket, can i get away with a bit higher compresion. was thinking of getting a head recoed for gas with a straight gas cam later on so if i can wait and do it then?

I used an impco 425 on mine and it worked well and had enough flow for around 300rwkw using single lines from the tank - could of made more with some tweaking. I looked into using a falcon electronic dizzy for mine but only decided against it as I found an IG5 for a good price - but I wouldnt use an IG5 anymore - id go something like an autronic SMC which can be had for well under $1k. But to answer your question - u definitly dont need a computer to run straight gas.

no ecu in this.. my dads daily on straight gas.. not running that dizzy anymore tho, pos hei Some original photos have not been recovered yet.

it would never have had an ecu, they're a carby motor....

Quote: Originally Posted by ralph [View Post] The way i said only needs stock dizy and ecu. no afm and no 02sener, The ECU is simple as! was made in the 80's. Just let it do the spark and be happy, that's all its good for. the ecu needs the AFM to calculate load. timing tables are load vs RPM. every ecu needs either a map or afm to calculate load, unless you want an ecu that does timing based on rpm only.

dont some of the early microtechs do that?

im setting up a gas turbo vl atm , plan is gen111 coils , megasqirt , do away with the dizy and i making a triger wheel that mounts to the ballancer ,and ive got a 3 bar map sensor , ive done away with the whole old engine loom and started from scratch , also running gra 480 and twin b2s , twin lock offs for each converter and twin outlet tank with twin lines its a mess atm but when its done i hope to make around 400rwk and all done fairly cheepley aswell with a ppi tank wich i plan to upgrade to at some stage with 6 outlet ports u could run nos and make alot more but i dont no how tuneing it would go , i plan to give it ago much later on thats a option for u but i was going to run standard turbo ecu and run impco 225 and one b2 with twin locks for it , that would of made around 220rwk or more and u could get that running for bugger all really , plus u could cut all the injectors loom out and weld up injector holes to make it look abit cleaner

Quote: Originally Posted by theVLguy [View Post] the ecu needs the AFM to calculate load. timing tables are load vs RPM. every ecu needs either a map or afm to calculate load, unless you want an ecu that does timing based on rpm only. The stuff i wrote about here is not stuff i'v read or been told. This is how i'v ran gas on my rb30 powered vl's for the past 3 years. At present I'm running an rb30 with the stock na ecu with no afm or throttle position sensor, no temp sensor or injectors. This setup is running 1.8bar (26psi) with a HX35 Holset. The car idles and drives smooth until around 3500rpm, then boost climbes quite rapid. I'm sure if you ask some people in the know about the stock ecu you will find out load imputs only controlled fuel and the ignotion curve is fixed and is hard to adjust. On other cars i'v turbo'd such as n15sss pulsar with the sr20 require the load imputs as you say from the afm etc to run at all with stock ecu and gas, This i know as i'v ran turbo gas set up on it as well.

Quote: Originally Posted by ralph [View Post] The stuff i wrote about here is not stuff i'v read or been told. This is how i'v ran gas on my rb30 powered vl's for the past 3 years. At present I'm running an rb30 with the stock na ecu with no afm or throttle position sensor, no temp sensor or injectors. This setup is running 1.8bar (26psi) with a HX35 Holset. The car idles and drives smooth until around 3500rpm, then boost climbes quite rapid. I'm sure if you ask some people in the know about the stock ecu you will find out load imputs only controlled fuel and the ignotion curve is fixed and is hard to adjust. On other cars i'v turbo'd such as n15sss pulsar with the sr20 require the load imputs as you say from the afm etc to run at all with stock ecu and gas, This i know as i'v ran turbo gas set up on it as well. DW i have tuned my NA ecu with the nistune chip in it, and i do know that the Fuel and Ignition tables are load (AFM) vs rpm, both ignition and fuel are very easy to tune vs AFM load. without the AFM and TPS the ecu will be running off the idle timming map which is only based on rpm. but hey im not here to tell you otherwise, it obviously works for you.